Sunday, 20 April 2008

god's puppets

A persistent refrain in the apologist's bank of sound bytes is that god killing people (committing genocide like in Noah's ark or simple death) is not a bad or evil thing because god created us, hence he can destroy us at will. Is this really the case though? Parents create their children, yet we cringe at the thought of a parent harming its child. So, why is it acceptable for god? Answer: it isn't. When god brought us into the world, he gained a moral imperative to treat us with justice, fairness, etc. It would be sheer cruelty to bring a person into the world with the express purpose of treating it badly, yet this is exactly what god does. god is not love, god is immorality and injustice.

When god sends people to hell, he is further guilty of immorality. He brought that soul into existence knowing that he would end up in hell for eternity being tortured. This is simple sadism.


Steven Bently I said...

God is exempt from his own commandments "Thou shalt not kill" please read my disclaimer (The Bible)

Tigerboy said...

I totally agree.

Imagine you are an all-powerful being. You can do anything you want. You decide to create a population of insignificant sinners, and then you give them the option to do good, to worship you, or else, into the hellfire with them . . . does this sound like a healthy mind?

It sounds sadistic and sick.

michael said...

As Dawkins so often says, it doesn't have to be nice to be true.

GCT said...

True. Just because we want something to be true because it is nice, doesn't make it so. And, Michael, I know you are satirizing, but it should be said that what is being discussed here is not that hell must be false because it is evil, but that the attributes given to god of being omni-max are logically inconsistent with the premise of the existence of hell. Or that it is a good thing when god kills us or sends us to hell. The argument is about the morality of the situation.

judy said...

Now, here is where folks go all awry, when trying to figure out what and Who God is.

1. The fact is, you're living on borrowed time purchased by Jesus. You have no right to life, at all.

2. God owes us no explanation.

You don't like that, do you? You think He owes you something. And that would be what?

Who are you to question God? One of those noisy ones in the flock. The sheep that bellows how unfair it is that he has black wool instead of white. Demanding the shepherd to do something about it.

Find the word 'fair' in the Bible.

GCT said...

"Now, here is where folks go all awry, when trying to figure out what and Who God is."

Yes, how dare we use the cognitive faculties that god supposedly gave us.

"1. The fact is, you're living on borrowed time purchased by Jesus. You have no right to life, at all."

Actually, that's far from established as fact. How did Jesus purchase my time? By dying? How did that do anything?

"2. God owes us no explanation."

Actually he does. He brought us into this world, so he owes us a moral obligation. By your logic, parents don't owe their children any explanation nor do they have a moral obligation to their children. We both know that that is not correct, however. So, why does god get a free pass from his moral obligations? Answer, he doesn't. It's just as immoral for god to treat us with contempt and ignore his moral responsibilities as any parent.

"Who are you to question God?"

A thinking and rational being with moral development. If god can't even be as moral as I am, why should we consider him worthy of worship?

"Find the word 'fair' in the Bible."

Then I suppose that you don't think god is omni-benevolent and omni-just?

MR. X said...

I think gct answered most of those points, 'judy'; but I'd just like to add: you seem to be pretty certain that the bible is conclusive philosophically; do you a) believe muslims will go to hell
b) believe atheists will go to hell
c) believe non-whites will go to hell.